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2011-10-08 Expert: Noth1ng Rate: (3.7)  11 ratings

kghin 8d way of play - never give up!

Confrontation between Firework 9d and kghin 8d ended after the game. People who constantly watch kghin 8d are well aware of his spirit - never give up! It's always amazing if a player forces kghin to resign. In this game Firework was far ahead after he killed b's groups, white got almost half of the board. The only way for white to lose was on time..and it happened. White was well ahead +20 points. It's no wonder Firework got very angry after the game:

Firework [9d]: why all the 9ds hate kghin
Firework [9d]: that's why he never get pro
Firework [9d]: and will never ever
Firework [9d]: caz he never resign
Firework [9d]: and always play ugly
Firework [9d]: he will never improve anymore
Firework [9d]: no, I will never play him again

Firework is very likely to be MilanMilan who used to say that kghin never resigns.  I still wonder why kghin plays this way, is it really fighting spirit or lack of manners or just childish behaviour?
You will never see a pro player continue playing if he's far behind, most likely he's just looking for a place to resign. It's a pity that you cannot respect your opponent, which often happens when playing online.


5d 2011-10-27 08:10
Once, I played in a real tournament game setting. Face-to-face, against my opponent.

I killed this twenty stone group and quickly followed that kill with another twenty stone group.

At that point, I cannot lie that I was not disgusted by his "tenacity," when there was evidently no hope at all. I was unaccustomed to the time settings, however, and I lost by time. He didn't dare warn me, and indeed, he didn't need to. But he was aware. Nonetheless, I was a bit aghast at the lack of sportsmanship, as he merely grunted as a hello and thank you.

You can say all you want that the ends justify the means, or that if he wants to win, he wins, or that there's no excuse but your own. But no, there's a limit to that. Face the facts people, a time win is nothing to brag about, and sometimes, the fault isn't completely your own.
5d ( US ) 2011-10-19 11:10
Hello I don't think what kghin did was wrong we all play on when we feel like we need to continue a game as the game continues we learn more firework does it as well and if anyone complains they shouldnt play him than no one said he had to play kghin firework obviously loves the attention and loves the way kghin plays otherwise he wouldnt have played him goodluck kghin ignore all the nasty comments of the pros who dont know the word improvement :-)
2011-10-16 05:10
"Both on Saturday and Sunday, the teacher was also lecturing about how losing is not shameful, and how one should always give one's utmost while playing. It must be due to this kind of teaching that I've found that it's really difficult to get the insei opponents to resign, even when they're clearly behind."

This is from Antti T?¶rm?¤nen's blog ( Right now he is an insei in Japan and playing against people who want to get better at go and become a professional.
( DE ) 2011-10-15 04:10
i think somebody should do a little research on go "culture" as it seems there are different opinions about rules and "rules" etc... doing interviews on go players all around the world would be interesting, cause i believe the way of playing is also an expression of your character and therefore an expressing of your socialisation, thus your culture. dont think this problem can be solved easily. interesting though, beyond the game of go
2011-10-12 11:10
A player with good manners should resign in a bad position.
A player with good manners should resign even if he is slightly worse.
Corollary: A player with good manners should always resign.
2011-10-11 09:10
So many whiny people here, talking about respect, like respect means a little help from the opponent to win the game faster.
There is a proverb that says that the most difficult is to win a winning game.
Who didn't let Firework to win the game?
Stop grumble. Just win the winning game, that difficult part of the proverb. Don't blame on time, on rain, on headache and so on.
4d ( US ) 2011-10-11 04:10
Petition-I heartily disagree. There is essentially no difference at all between losing by 30 or 40. You've lost. Resign, and have respect. Go is about winning and losing, not about losing by less. Kghin is a real punk sometimes.
3k 2011-10-10 07:10
Wow, lotta folks got a problem with people who don't resign. Yeah, it's annoying if someone's just trying to win on time, or waiting for you to get bored and quit, like folks who refuse to pass once the game is done. But kghin never does that, he just wants to play it out.

I've heard some strong players say that this is a way to practice. Regardless of the final score, in every part of the game there are good moves and bad moves, bigger moves and smaller moves. Go is a non-zero sum game. There is a difference between losing by 40 and by 30.

one of the only comments i agree with in this thread is that players are free to choose opponents who like similar kinds of games to the ones they like. If this firework character likes fast games where people resign readily, then sure, go play people who do that. But don't put down kghin for playing differently.

And making grumpy statements about how kghin will never be a pro just makes Firework seem foolish.
6k ( AT ) 2011-10-09 01:10
I can understand the emotion and people dragging on to win by time, as it happens or happened on yahoo games is a nightmare and should be punishable.
on the other hand EVERY player has a right to fight the inevitable until the end. otherwise i could never be allowed to play against a dan player, since no question who wins. therefore i should either not play or resign after move 1. as kyu player i think this is arrogance unfortunately not too rarely found in go.

ad noth1ing: the analogy with soccer is just .... ehm .... outlandish - since this is an offline game :)
2011-10-09 05:10
I agree with noth1ng. The marathon analogy does not gold: in running, every meter counts the same, and the later part of the race can be even harder than the first part. This is not true in go.

Once a side has a 40 point advantage in the middle game, the real game is over. There is no challenge in it anymore, it becomes a dull question whether I can always click fast enough for the clock, but still slow enough not to misclick or blunder something big. This has little to do with Go.

It is true nobody has the right to ask his opponent to give up. But everyone has the right to choose the opponent - and play against players with similar interests.
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